have you read Apo's books?

[dyaoko]

have you ever read APO's books , and do you know how many books he has ?and what are their names and in which language they been written ?

I myself in Iran had just chance to read a very small book about ochalan.

it was written by a Turkish jornalist who had done interview with Ochalan .
that book was censored by Turkish government.
then that book was translated to arabic and the arab writer had changed some parts to his own benefit.

and then that perian guy Translated that ARabic book to farsi and changed parts of it to his own benefit and again iran governemnt censored parts of the book...

so I read a very few words from apo's mouth ,,and it was indirectly ...
the words that was changed 3 times , first by turks then by arabs and then persians...

by the way , a friend sent me a link to Sorani Version of Apo's book ,
called "Defending a NAtion" or something...like that .

here is the link to download , http://www.ferheng.org/pirtuk/PAREZNEMEKTEB.pdf
it is 5 MB .

[Piling]

He has written many and many books... in Turkish. All of them are awfully dull and crazy, as his speeches, I guess... I have just red some extracts in English.

Ask to Tom, he has studied a lot of them for his masterwork.

[tomjez]

It's fascinating. This man is a mix between Socrate, Jesus, Mahommet and Marx.

Well at least, he pretends to be ) "Sun of mankind"...

[tomjez]

I have one of them in english "from sumerian clerical state to democratic civilization" (so basically "history of mankind") VOLUME 1 (that's scary) which was put with his ECHR defence submission.

I really doubt they read it. 719 pages (in word format) and well slightly boring. only 17 pages about kurds



CONTENTS

Foreword ……………………………………………………………………
Section One
SLAVE SOCIETY AND CIVILIAN DEVELOPMENT…………………..
A- Sumer: Civilisation on the Banks of Tigris and Euphrates……………..
B- Historical Role and Institutionalisation of Sumerian Civilisation……..
C- Permanent Effects of Sumerian Civilisation…………………………...
D- Question of Methodology in Historical Development and Expansion…
E- Expansion and Maturation State of Slave Society………………………
1- Egyptian Civilisation……………………………………………….
2- Harappa and Mohenjo-Daro Civilisations
in Punjab and Indus Valleys of India………………………………….
3- Chinese Civilisation
F- Slave City States Period in the Middle East……………………………..
1- Period of Development in Agriculture and Domestication of Animals
2- Institutionalisation and Transition to Tribal Regime…………………
3- The Period Between the Formation of Civilisation, Several Basic Class Structures Until the Present…………………………………………...
I- Hittites………………………………………………………..
II- Hurri, Guti, Mitanni, Urartu and Mede Civilisations…………
III- Civilisation in the Eastern Mediterranean; Earliest and Most Combined Effects of Sumerian and Egyptian Civilisations upon the Eastern Mediterranean Region…………………………
IV- Cretan Civilisation………………………………………….
V- Sumerian and Egyptian Civilisations………………………

G- Resistance to Slave Society and Reformation…………………………
I- Emergence and Role of Monotheist Religions in Civilisation
II- Resistance of Ethnicities and Slave Society…………………….
III- Development of Philosophical Thought and Civilisation (A Brief History of Consciousness and Spiritual Development)
1- Zoroaster and Zoroastrianism………………………….
2- Buddhism……………………………………………
3- Confucius…………………………………………….
4- Socrates and the Era of Social Philosophy………….
H- Peak of Slave Civilisation……………………………………………..
I- Greek Civilisation……………………………………………...
a- Alimentation With Neolithic Era……………………..
b- Alimentation With Civic Era………………………….


II- Roman Period of Slave Civilisation………………………..
III- Emergence of Media-Persia and East-West Crossroads……
I- Collapse of Slave Society……………………………….…………….
a- Emergence and Development……………………………
b- Maturation and Expansion………………………………
c- Classical Era or Peak and Collapse of Civilisation……..
d- Legacy of Slave Society…………………………………

[tomjez]

I'm not sure volume II was written (also he has a lot of free time now)

Volume I was written in jail. Turkey should release him just to prevent volume II from being edited

here is the foreword...


The circumstances of my trial period in Imrali, the urgency of avoiding the potential use of violence that is the product of the conspiracy that brought about my arrest, the need to prevent an opportunity being given to the conspirators and the expectations of their supporters, in addition, doing the right thing and contributing to an honourable peace, however limited, all necessitated some efforts on my part. The most practical approach was that which the defence was based upon, a peaceful and democratic solution. The fact cannot be forgotten that an atmosphere of political lynching was present in these circumstances. I still believe that those sound-minded circles and people of authority were not aware of the logic of the developing conspiracy in Turkey, and they were not prepared for the direction of this development. Conditions for a reliable decision making mechanism were either non-existent or very limited. The conspiracy itself offered a heaven sent present to chauvinism, which reached a degree of hysteria at the peak of the twentieth century as if it were a Roman game in the shape of feeding the lions in the arena. The matter in question was in fact the staging of an inescapable blind violence, which not only was beyond the aims of the PKK but also was exactly the opposite of them. It is such a pity and so unfortunate that those opposing one another believed, or were led to believe, that reaching the point of suicidal attacks and considering any form of resistance was their own most justifiable right. So much the worse, some parties in this game were unable to grasp the circumstances of their engagement. One of the greatest treacheries of the era was that, whilst they presented themselves as friendly and in favour of freedoms, they cruelly destroyed those most victimised and heroic individuals and condemned them to oblivion. The arena was left to traitors and collaborators waiting in ambush, and time and again they emerged from such environments.
In actual fact everything envisaged my death. The aim was to destroy me, predominantly physically and if not, what I stood for. Whilst giving this great consideration, I cannot think of any aim other than that. The conspiracy was so deep and full of unknowns that exposing it necessitated a very advanced humanitarian response, which seemed as impossible as a miracle. This cruel fate was engineered in such a fashion that the whole world was reduced to the role of the party opposite, and closest friends and comrades were left with nothing but “an honourable death” appropriate to their moral values and firm beliefs. This was the logic of the era. Both friend and foe shared this logic. (Bastards, they wanted him to die as a heroe!) Everything was condemning me to a terrible solitude. Although according to the rules of warfare a “firing squad” would have been a right as opposed to a far-fetched punishment, I was even denied this right. The civilisation wished to take its revenge somehow differently.
I have never aspired to heroism. NO KIDDING Notwithstanding that I do not have that kind of courage and wished to be seen as I am, I am very aware of the fact that I have never given evidence to be seen as such in the eyes of even my closest friends. However there is a side of me that I would never betray: I was going to continue to be the child who did not betray his dreams. I was not going to recognise the gods of civilisation, dissolve within their institutions, and be the family man of their wives. The dialectics of my personality managed to transcend such a development. The matter in question went beyond being a simple internal contradiction of Turkey. My circumstances almost condemned me to be a modern Prometheus. It is such a bitter and sad analogy that nailing me on the rocks of Imrali was no different than legendary Prometheus having being nailed on the mountains of Caucasia. The grandchildren of Zeus, the arch god of Athens, also did this.

Moscow, one of the most prominent centres of civilisation, in return for a few contracts and a few billions worth of IMF credits, was not going to be perturbed by its role in the matter concerning me as they staged an unrivalled treachery against the socialism, however imperfect, adopted by millions. In Rome however the arena of classical slavery hand in hand with the intricate plans of modern capitalism was going to disregard all moral and legitimate values and, with the application of psychological terror, was going to force me into a fight for my honour and I was going to end up complying with whatever was necessary. Athens however was going to exploit the belief named friendship in its lowliest form, which couldn’t have been imagined or hoped for by the most professional prosecution, and was going to pack me away to the capital of Kenya, the land of cannibals. The most sinister, torturous, senseless, self-seeking mentality of the twentieth century civilisation was going to engrave its face and I was going to stand aghast. The facing reality, which paralysed my reflexes, was truthfully as portrayed. Those expecting a different attitude will not be able to deduce the ideological and moral outcomes unless they faced and felt the reality in their bones in all its dimensions.
I have never believed in fate. However, I was not going to wait in grave silence for the twentieth century’s modern crucifixion staged by the forces of fate. So in a few pages he is prometheus, grand son of zeus, and Jesus, not bad.


If my presence had any meaning at all I was going to dedicate every last grain of my consciousness for humanity, until the last beat of my heart, as the manifestation of my own virtue, and leave the rest to the natural process.
Those who wish to understand my stance in Imrali may benefit from this brief description, that this is not a criticism, self-criticism, and an expectation for forgiveness or survival in any shape or form. Any expectation in this direction cannot possibly be the meaning and virtue of my life. The situation is somehow different and necessitates a grasp of its originality and uniqueness. Without hesitation I was not going to allow myself to be used by giving priority to the political attitude and the expectations of the left and the right of the civilisation, which I consider as being secondary in nature. This is because I have never been sceptical about the deeply ingrained true nature of favouring peace and fraternity, however limited it may be. I was going to seek dignity in this without allowing myself to be condemned by the curse of modern civilisation. Provided that a fraternal partnership in life leads the way to an honourable peace and freedom I was going to consider any form of political approach. Where I never paid much attention to the value of separated political islands and believed that they led the way to fantasy, poverty and deprivation, I was going to prefer unity based on free self-expression at every level. As ever, I was going to continue my meaningful stance that I was not going to fall for forced separation in the same way that I wouldn’t back a forced unity.
This is the true spirit of my defence in Imrali. I hope that its value is appreciated better by the day. If we ever managed to stop the true terror, which was the produce of a cursed blind fate, and slowed down the interests of cruel rentier exploitation, if we ever proved the validity and the meaning of the democratic path of political struggle, if we contributed towards the indication of legitimate armed struggle against those forces denying peace, that would only mean that we assumed an attitude that those with a sense of justice and true feelings would appreciate.
On these basis I am in a position to use my right for defence regarding the ECHR, feeling that it is my duty to evaluate the democratic legal platform in order to say the words that became universal and had to be said on peoples’ behalf if history is to be enlightened correctly, East vis-à-vis West, and the Middle Eastern culture, which I regard as of historic importance, is to be defended against the European civilisation on this basis. I do not have any qualms and do not think it is wrong that this platform envisaging peace and democratic unity, however limited, may benefit Turkey in its application for membership of the EU. This is because all the wholesale social problems we are facing may find an answer, whilst the oligarchic dead-end contrasts with the logic and the esprit of the formation of Turkey. Europe is in an advanced stage. Without adopting the aspects enriching it, there is no possibility for the cultures of the East and the Middle East, which I always believed in, to gather pace. Sharing the values of the EU in accordance with the justified interests of social forces is not a cheap and obvious form of collaboration, whilst it is clear in my mind that opposing this is nothing other than old fashioned and reactionary conservatism, which has nothing to do with being progressive. Due to the circumstances that led to my arrest and the forces that carried it out being the dominant forces of modern civilisation, it is obvious that my defence is to be staged in this fashion. Demystifying my European adventure has urgency due to the fact that there are lessons to be learnt from it. At this point if we bury ourselves into Turkey solely, or the Middle Eastern reality, it will not be possible to see the truth in its entirety. Searching for both the source and the solution of the problem within the European civilisation has decisive importance. Due to their inability to grasp this particular uniqueness, so far a large number of so called national liberation movements either got stuck with solutions which were surpassed by the European civilisation and only became a hindrance, or ending up drowning in the vortex of an even worse policy of “divide and rule”. Not only are nationalism, fundamentalism, and an undemocratic stance the values which Europe abandoned a long time ago, but supranational institutionalisation, cultural democratic life and a degree of democratisation within the system deepening to reach the individual's rights became universal modern values with a proven track record. How it reached that particular point requires an analysis of the civilisation.
The other important reason is greater than a personal tragedy embodied in my person, this being but a faithful manifestation of what the Kurdish people have experienced as consequence of the practice shown to us. A correct description of the Kurdish reality will lead the way in a problem that has occupied the European agenda for quite some time. This analysis principally has the importance that it will determine the fate of democracy in Turkey. Within this context, a democratic solution in Turkey will contribute to solutions of the crucial problems experienced in the Middle East, Caucasia, Central Asia and even in the Balkans. The great international importance of the problem derives from such a reality. In addition to that, both those who denied the problem so far, and those who brought unrealistic, exaggerated and inapplicable solutions will not only jeopardise this positive contribution but also will lead the way to deepening and prolonging the crisis.
Due to having played an important part in the problem reaching this point, and whilst conducting an important debate on the Kurdish phenomenon, a comprehensive, scientific and analytical approach is regarded most suitable for the foundations of the defence.
Therefore we are going to make a historical analysis of the civilisation in general outline if not in detail, and along with reaching the source of the problem in hand we will interlink this guide to the solution with the solution of the problem itself. So far both denials, as well as chauvinistic, romantic approaches without any scientific value, have always been the main cause of adverse results which not only gained nothing but cost so much. Abandoning problems to decay must be the worst method. Attempting to annihilate a problem might have a logic, but abandoning it to decay has no logic at all.
As in all problems concerning peoples facing fundamental social problems, identifying the reality of the Kurdish people, a reliable diagnosis of the illness, and finding appropriate treatment is closely connected with the method of approach. Getting over the schematic approaches of real socialism, something that was not carried out enough during the emergence of the PKK, along with pointing out and solving the negative attitudes that principally caused pain, meaningless losses, and impasse and which were prominently caused by the romantic influences of primitive Kurdish nationalism, necessitated this study. So far this task has not been carried out as it deserves and it is time for everyone to take up this responsibility in proportion to their abilities, even if it causes great pain. Of course, only those strong and responsible enough will be able to deal with this task sufficiently.
These were the reasons for an analysis of the civilisation in general terms. Such analyses may be well established for a large number of societies and nations. Their comprehensive historical and social studies may have permitted this. However for the Kurdish phenomenon it is still necessary and needs to have meaning. Whilst doing this, an historical approach must be regarded as the basis. No matter how undefined or dull, there is a Kurdish history. Without shedding light on this history it is impossible to see the present and diagnose or apply treatment to this reality, which has become an impasse. When the historical method is successful an unsurpassed power of solution emerges which will also lead the way, in direct proportion, to a refinement. Complying with fundamental historical perspectives in main stages will enable us to grasp the present, turn blindness to comprehension, and will prove that rich perspectives for solutions are possible. The importance of this approach reveals itself far better once one is reminded that both the religious and extreme nationalist approaches, whilst exaggerating the effectiveness of single-dimensional imaginary approaches, have shown their blinding effect. In this context it is not too late. Once compared with the Palestinian problem or similar problems not only does the great impasse become visible, but also abandoning the nationalist approach, engrossed with the religious dimensions that throughout the centuries worsened the problems, becomes unavoidable. This is an inevitability of the modern, scientific, democratic approach. It is vitally important that all relevant sections and institutions should discover the originality of this method and adapt their policies accordingly. The nature of Turkey’s crisis reached such a complexion that such an approach has become an unavoidable duty.
Of course the most dominant dimension of the various historical and contemporary relationships of the Kurdish reality is the Kurdish-Turkish relationship. It is vital that this dimension should be dealt with in depth and comprehensively. If the desired solution is going to be within the unity of the state structure and on the basis of democratic principals, a scientific analysis of the history of these relationships becomes more relevant. Even those who are not interested in the Kurdish question should be reminded that when integrating a large number of Turkic states and societies under one state structure, even a limited solidarity amongst them can only be possible through the discovery of contemporary reality and the historical nature of such solidarity. At present the most obvious reality is that romantic approaches cause reactions. They are wrong and insufficient methods. The necessity to democratically reform the Turkish-Kurdish relationship in a comprehensive fashion makes identifying the rights and wrongs of the relationship, in order to re-establish and reform them, an urgent task. Naturally reforms emerge from internal dynamism, but the EU reality, which it is believed we are part of and whose membership is sought after, doubles the importance of the matter and the efforts towards it. Internal and external conjunctural reform does not become a dead weight but an opportunity to exit an even larger crisis.
The PKK dimension of this defence has an even greater importance. A scientific evaluation of the PKK is not only necessary for the members and the mass of supporters, but also for those who are opposed to it. Merely tagging it with the label of terrorism has no analytical value. Alternatively, it can only lead to greater mistakes to suggest that, “everything we did was sacred”. At present not only within Turkey but also in the relevant geographical section of the Middle East the concept of Kurdish-ness is very much linked with the PKK. A diligent analysis of the PKK will not only bring about a meaningful self-criticism, but will also make way for potential solutions.
Whenever the PKK is mentioned two basic subjects emerge. It is vitally important that the terms “terrorism” and “secession” need explaining. Of course the historic and social background behind these concepts, in addition to the ideologies and practices of contemporary revolutions, need thorough revisions. Even more importantly the obstinate terrorism that suppressed the Kurdish reality entirely, built up throughout the history, and remained on the agenda permanently, also needs a scientific analysis. This terrorist approach, for which the banning of economic, cultural, social and political free development did not suffice, but also stretched to a constitutional ban on language, needs an evaluation from the political, military point of view along with the legal and democratic perspective. Therefore shedding light upon the conceptual and institutional evaluations that constituted the grounds for and supports for the PKK, which also derived from an opposite conceptual stance, bears an importance. On this basis it is extremely important to bring political and legal explanations, with their rights and wrongs, to concepts and theories such as socialism, independence, freedom, democracy, nationalism, force, terror, indivisible unity, nationhood, unity and separatism. The examination of the theoretical and practical aspects of the PKK, which received more than its fair share of the crude formulation of such concepts and theories, will contribute to the process for a positive solution. Both excessive accusations and defensive approaches are clearly and understandably not contributing to a solution. Whilst there were many evaluations from within and without, opposing or supporting the PKK, the uniqueness of the Kurdish question should be borne in mind - that they have been banned, suppressed, kept away from social developments, from political approaches, whilst being marred with pain and violence. Any evaluation that does not take into account the cause-effect relationship is doomed to be subjective whilst bringing about dangerous political implications. This does not lead the way to a solution but in essence is a way to an impasse. I regard it as important to get over this hurdle. I consider that the task that has fallen on me is not only a great responsibility but also a historic task. This is because it is a very difficult task for someone else to deal with. As long as evaluations relevant to the PKK are meaningful, realistic, and contributing towards the solution, they will also create a chance for a very necessary self-criticism. Approaches such as pure condemnation and accusation will not only reduce the chances of reformation but also will strengthen those inflexible and conservative attitudes and mentalities. The importance of this approach becomes more striking when the existing practice of closing the doors of democratic politics to the left, the right, and religious tendencies results in a vicious circle and a waste of resources. At this point the supremacy of Europe is that after lengthy experience it has managed to keep its doors open to democratic politics and all kinds of free self-expression. Believing in the correctness of, and giving a chance to, this method is the realistic and contemporary path to bringing a solution to the problem.
Violence being abandoned as a solution to the Kurdish question, the policies of denial and oppression being superseded even if to a limited degree, are all relevant to the democratic alternative with its intended true nature. The ban on education and broadcasting, on the language and culture, is not only the most extreme form of terrorism but also issues an invitation to a counter-violence. Within the PKK violence had been used beyond control and in excess of legitimate self-defence. Presently a large number of movements are known to have used excessive forms of violence. As opposed to this our unilateral ceasefire and adoption of legitimate defence positions predominantly outside the borders makes the accusation of “terrorism” redundant. What should be done is to employ methods leaving the door open to a process of dialogue and democratic unity and to abandon the weapons completely. A comprehensive evaluation of the PKK’s existing position provides an important opportunity to prevent undesirable developments, which would be difficult to solve. Leaving the door open to a legal democratic transformation of the PKK in Turkey is a correct, more realistic and practical solution than attempting to ban and liquidate it entirely.
In my defence, and as a preference, my fundamental method had been a flexible approach without losing sight of this. As opposed to a separatist, nationalist mode of struggle within the borders of each country where the Kurdish problem is experienced, I regarded democratic unity in the general contours of the Middle East through recognition of freedoms and the fraternity of peoples in peace, as the more realistic political approach against poverty. Numerous contemporary experiences witness that micro-nationalism has led the way to clashes, insolubility and in some occasions added more complex problems to those potentially soluble problems. To avoid the Kurdish problem, which has a very high potential for clashes, becoming another Palestine-Israel conflict necessitates a great responsibility. A democratic Middle East alternative has to be borne in mind as a strategic aim at all times.
The ECHR process also gives us the opportunity to test the possibilities of legal solutions and at the same time gives us the chance to evaluate them. Above and beyond my personal concern, the ECnHR (European Convention of Human Rights), which Turkey is a signatory to, portrays a general situation. The three layers of rights recognised by the UN, in other words the individual’s civil rights, economic and social rights, and the free expression of people’s cultural rights, were portrayed in greater detail and comprehension in the ECnHR and become an obligation to all member countries. A large number of cases that were taken to the ECHR resulted in a radical handling of the matter, which necessitated ascertaining a legal norm beyond and above the individual. Individual decisions for thousands of cases no longer became realistic and a relevant legal regulation through the national Parliament became an inevitability. Starting from the right to live, Turkey is the only CoE member not complying with the Convention in its entirety. Even regarding the membership application to the EU, as a candidate even the requirements of the Copenhagen criteria, which were another form of the ECnHR, are not complied with. There is a wish that my personal application has a speeding effect on this. In addition to this, if Turkey wishes I am in a position to state that I am prepared for a friendly solution. This aspect of my defence correctly evaluates the possibility that the legal process may contribute to a political solution. In essence, instead of the military and harsh political methods as often employed in the past, an alternative solution within the framework of a democratic constitutional state is envisaged. This necessity for Turkey is evaluated with responsibility, and a wish was expressed for the opening of the door to a political dialogue by way of enlarging those friendly to a solution. I regarded it as a historic responsibility to analyse my personal position in greater detail. Beyond the technical requirements of the Court, and with the disadvantage of the narrative becoming more literary, it was an inescapable duty to explain some circumstances and the truth underlying the case. Apart from the breach of international law, disregard of numerous moral values forced me to concentrate on this aspect of my defence in greater detail. In my person the present tragedy of the Kurdish people, their infinite solitude through their cursed history, their becoming the tools of numerous plots and having experienced unseen betrayals, can only be explained with greater detail. The aim of this is at least to say stop to this tragedy and divert it towards contemporary development. This particular chapter may also be regarded as the conclusion and summary section of my defence.
It is inevitable that based on this foreword my defence is far from being complete. One of the factors that should be stated is that my three-year long isolation in Imrali had wearing effects on memory and language. However, the lessons I extracted from the cruel practice and the intensity of my experience led me to believe that this study will be of beneficial service to relevant circles and I tried to comply with my duty to write after a lengthy period[/i]

[Piling]

waoh. 700 âges llike that, and it is not his sole book... But it is a temptation to translate it in french, just for joking of Belgians santors...

[tomjez]

Well actually you can read the foreword because it says a lot about the psychology of the man, but the rest .... honestly this must have been a torture for young PKK militants to study his books. No wonder they all have the same strange absence of light in their eyes...

[Piling]

Yes but the PKK told them they have to learn suffering and martyre, it was a good start.

[Vladimir]

Didnt know Ocalan wrote history. Is this "marxist" history or?

[Piling]

Not marxist. Apoist History. Only Apoist.

[Vladimir]

LIfestory about Apo from Assyrians and Sumerians till Apo ..??

Or about class struggle.. socialistic views.. etc..??

[Piling]

I guess that it's : Sumerian life explained by Apo (for before him no one has understood their history), Assyrian life explained by Apo (for before him no one has understood their history)... Napoleon explained by Apo (for before him no one has understood hishistory).... until the ultimate point : Apo explained by Apo.

His thought is : before he borns, all the history was a long long long road leading to this perfect achievment : Apo's reign.

A kind of determinism so.

[Vladimir]

Isn't this book edited.. or?? I don't see why the Turks wouldn't edit his book.

[tomjez]

You can find it on internet somewhere but honestly...

[Vladimir]

Yeah.. Abdullah Öcelan dot COM.
It's not the PKK .. that doesn't trust the book.. but me;).

Seriously.. hehe