Sorani + Kurmanci Mix = New Kurdish!

[Johny Bravo]

What do you think about a idea of a new mixed kurdish?

the presense

english: i make
sorani: min ekem, kurmanci: ez dikim
new kurdish (sorani+kurmanci mix): ez ekem

english: i go
sorani: min eçem, kurmanci: ez diçim
new kurdish: ez eçem

english: i eat
sorani: min exwem, kurmanci: ez dixwim
new kurdish: ez exwem

english: i give
sorani: min edem, kurmanci: ez didim
new kurdish: ez edem

english: i take
sorani: min egirem, kurmanci: ez digirim
new kurdish: ez egirem

english: i see
sorani: min ebînem, kurmanci: ez dibînim
new kurdish: ez ebînem

english: i say
sorani ?, kurmanci: ez dibêjim
new kurdish: ??

english: i know
sorani: min ezanem, kurmanci: ez dizanim
new kurdish: ez ezanem

english: i want
sorani: min exwazem, kurmanci: ez dixwazim
new kurdish: ez exwazem

english: i live
sorani: min ejem, kurmanci: ez dijim
new kurdish: ez ejem

english: i laugh
sorani: min pê ekenem, kurmanci: ez dikenim
new kurdish: ez ekenem

english: i cry
sorani: min egrem, kurmanci: ez digrim
new kurdish: ez egrem

why "ez"? because its the most original version in iranian languages, in avesta was this also "ez" -> "äzîm" -> ezîm. the "min" is already used by the function "mine".

the pronouns

english: i
sorani: min, kurmanci: ez
new kurdish: ez

english: you
sorani: to, kurmanci: tu
new kurdish: tu (because "to" sounds too persian)

english: he/she
sorani: ew, kurmanci: ew
new kurdish: ew

english: we
sorani: ême, kurmanci: em
new kurdish: em (because "ê-me" sounds too persian)

english: you (many persions)
sorani: Êwe, kurmanci: hûn, kalhori: îwe
new kurdish: hîwe

english: they
sorani: ewan, kurmanci: ewan
new kurdish: ewan

english: me, mine
sorani: min, kurmanci: min
new kurdish: min

english: your, you
sorani: to, kurmanci: te
new kurdish: te (because "to" sounds persian)

english: his, him
sorani: ew, kurmanci: wî, kalhori: ewe
new kurdish: ewî

english: her
sorani: nothing, kurmanci: wê, kalhori: ewe
new kurdish: ewê

english: our, us
sorani: ême, kurmanci: me, kalhori: îme
new kurdish: îme (becase "me" look likes persian "ma")

englsish: your, yours
sorani: êwe, kurmanci. we
new kurdish: we (because: ewe is already used by "her")

english: their
sorani: Êwe, Wan
new kurdish: wan (because ewan -> wan has more logic)

demonstrive pronouns

english: this
sorani: ew, kurmanci: ev
new kurdish: ev (because "ew" is already used by "he/she")

english: them
kurmanci: vî, sorani =?
new kurdish = ?

english: them
kurmanci: vê (for feminin, sorani = ?
new kurdish = ?

english: this (plural)
kurmanci: van, sorani = ?
new kurdish = ?

personal ending

english: i am
sorani: min em, kurmanci: ez im
new kurdish: ez em

english: you are
sorani: to yî, kurmanci: tu yî
new kurdish: tu yî

english: we are
sorani: ême in, kurmanci: em in,
new kurdish: em in

english: he/she is
sorani: ew e, kurmanci: ew e
new kurdish: ew e

english: you are
sorani: êwe en, hûn in
new kurdish: hîwe (y)in

english: they are
sorani: ewan en, kurmanci: ewan in
new kurdish: ewan en

Ownership structure

sorans use generally as persians or turks posessive pronouns, like "malem" > my house. kurmancs say "mala min". what is here the solution? the persian way is false. the izafe-system is here better and more originally. the posessive pronouns are a broken version of the izafe system.

example:
the "malem" came by "malê-min", the "in" went.
the "malit" came bye "mali-to", the "o" went.

izafe in some sorani-dialects: nawî min = my name
izafe in kurmanci: navê min
example for feminin genus: hevala te = your girlfriend

new kurdish: izafe for Ownership structure:
ê for masculin, a for feminin

asking words

english: who
sorani: kê, kurmanci: ki
new kurdish: kê (ki sounds too persian, also in many kurmanc-dialect it is "ke" or "Çê")

english: how
sorani: Çon, kurmanci: Çawa(n), kalhori: Çun
new kurdish: Çowan

english: when
sorani: kenge, kurmanci: kenge
new kurdish: kenge

english: why
kurmanci: Çima, sorani: bo Çî
new kurdish: ?

english: where
kurmanci: ku, sorani: kwê
new kurdish: ku (is more original)

some verbs, prepositions and adjectives

english: to say
kurmanci: gotin, sorani: kutin / gutin, wutin
new kurdish: gutin

english: hunger
kurmanci: Birçî, sorani: birsî, kalhori: birsî
new kurdish: birşî (the best compromise)

english: thirst
kurmanci: Tînî: sorani: Tînû, kalhori: Tînig
new kurdish: tînû

english: village
sorani: gund / dê, kurmanci: gund
new kurdish: gund (because "dê" looks like persian "de")

english: in
sorani: le, kurmanci: li, kelhori: le
new kurdish: le

english: from
sorani: le, kurmanci: ji
new kurdish: je

english: to
sorani: bo / be, kurmanci: bo
new kurdish: bo

nouns

english: name
sorani: naw, kurmanci: nav
new kurdish: naw

english: language
sorani: ziwan, kurmanci: ziman
new kurdish: ziman

etc.

what are your ideas?

[dyaoko]

intresting idea, I think kurds should learn both (not nessecary speak both but undrestand both)

in the past I had an idea, , Girls learn kirmanci and Boys learn Sorani (no matter if they are sorani or kirmanci themselvies) that we can always undrestand each other

[Newroztv]

Hi , Slaw , Slav


I don't think its a good idea to ignore some Kurdish words , I do speak both dialects perfectly and that make me feel happy most of the time because I can Deal with Kurdish Every where ( I already been in East and North of Kurdistan ) .

I will tell you the reason why I don't agree with you , The people who dislike the Kurds , They say Kurds are not one nation but a multi nation and they don't have their own and united language , but some professional people ad language scientist say the most important thing in Kurdish language is : Kurds have too many dialects and that make their language very rich , some time I watch some interviews on the Kurdish TV , for example the announcer is Sorani and the Guest is Badini and I see they can easily have a dialog and vise versa so , I guess if the Kurds really love each other they can understand each other + now the Media can do better and don't forget we have too many Satellite TV & Radio and all of these will effect on Kurdish language + the Music , little by little We will have a rich language

[Johny Bravo]

a question, what use the sorans by the majority for "to say" and for " i say"?

@dayaoko
thank you

@newroz
which has to do it with richness, if sorans say "ekem" and kurmancs "dikim", if sorans say "ziwan" and kurmancs "ziman", if sorans say "eme" and kurmancs "em"? One should standardize at least identical words. sorani and kurmanci are the same language.

continuation of my ideas

the "d" in sorani is sounds too persian. examples:

english: i made
kurmanci: min kir
sorani: min kird
persian: man kard(am)
new kurdish: min kir

english: cold
kurmanci: sar
sorani: sard
persian: sard
new kurdish: sar

[dyaoko]

I have aother idea, for grammar we can speak our own garam (sorani or korimanci)

for for Words (like nouns) we must learn all the kurdish words in both dialect
and you know what ?

both kirmanic and sorani have some with Persian ,
by my idea when a word in sorani is the same with persian , we should use its kirmanci , and when a word in kirmanci is the same with persian , we should use sorani.

(so those tricky persians dont tell us our language is a diallect of persian)

[Johny Bravo]

I have aother idea, for grammar we can speak our own garam (sorani or korimanci)

but, if sorans and kurmancs use in some parts the same grammer, as example in the presense-system, then is standardization necessary.

like: dikim / dekem -> ekem

for for Words (like nouns) we must learn all the kurdish words in both dialect
and you know what ?

both kirmanic and sorani have some with Persian ,
by my idea when a word in sorani is the same with persian , we should use its kirmanci , and when a word in kirmanci is the same with persian , we should use sorani.

(so those tricky persians dont tell us our language is a diallect of persian)

this is a good idea. you mean, the sorans should take words of kurmanc if their own words persian- similarly and the kurmancs also if their words persian- similarly.

you agree with me, that it is necessary that one standardized the identic nouns as ziman, "kir", birsî etc. and also the pronouns?

[Amanc]

Hevalno, LANGUAGE is not something that we can create, we cant "create" a news kurdish language, a standart language or whatever. language is something that arises by itself, it arises by ppl speaking the language. you cant create something and ask / force ppl to use it, how is that going to work?

as kak dyaoko said, we must learn both dialects. variety in culture and language is not a bad thing.

[Johny Bravo]

makes a diffrent if someone says "dikim" or somone says "ekem"? why the institutes dont should standardized this simple and identic words? then the turks and other enemys could not say "kurdish ist not existing".

you say:

Hevalno, LANGUAGE is not something that we can create

why than it "nûce" using in tvs and not the arabic "xaber"?

variety in culture and language is not a bad thing.

variety in only one and the same language makes not sense. and its also not makes sense its kurmancs and sorans dont understand eachother cause of little differences that can be standardized.

it is richness if a north german say "isch mach" and a south german "i moch"? i think not. richness were if the words are completly different and not the same. and identical words and identical grammer parts must be standardized as "ziman" - "ziwan", "kirin" - "kirdin", kutin - gotin, ki - kê, em - eme, di - e, birchî - birsî, nav - naw, chawan - chon, ku - kwê.

ok the grammer is not important and it is better if the grammer remains the same. but identical words must be standardized like "eme" -> "em".

[Amanc]

makes a diffrent if someone says "dikim" or somone says "ekem"? why the institutes dont should standardized this simple and identic words? then the turks and other enemys could not say "kurdish ist not existing".

Who cares about turks? They will always deny us.

why than it "nûce" using in tvs and not the arabic "xaber"?

nûce is a kurdish word, just like dengûbas. ofcourse we should use our own kurdish words and not arabic ones, but what does that have to do with standard kurdish?

variety in only one and the same language makes not sense. and its also not makes sense its kurmancs and sorans dont understand eachother cause of little differences that can be standardized

Let us take Southern Kurdistan as an example. Kurmanc and Sorans live together. Would you say they dont understand eachother? Do they have problems in commnication? I dont think so. At least I didn't notice anything like that yet.

it is richness if a north german say "isch mach" and a south german "i moch"? i think not. richness were if the words are completly different and not the same. and identical words and identical grammer parts must be standardized as "ziman" - "ziwan", "kirin" - "kirdin", kutin - gotin, ki - kê, em - eme, di - e, birchî - birsî, nav - naw, chawan - chon, ku - kwê.

You take germany as an example, but I think you don't get my point when I say u cannot "create" a language. In Germany ppl used to speak many different dialects and "didnt understand eachother" as you say, until Martin Luther translated the bible into german language in 1521. Germans started to use the language Luther used in the translations (which was actually in the dialect of the region Luther was from) more and more. it took more than 250 years until that language became "standard" all over Germany. and even then there was no standard writing, ppl used to write the words in many different ways. it is a big process.

Let us say you can create a standard kurdish language on a high scientific level. Well, very good. what are you going to do then? are you going to make people give up their native dialect and use the new standard language? do you want to teach millions of kurds a new language?

the different kurdish dialects mean much more. they are regional and cultural identity of the people using the dialects

i have the feeling people make a big thing out of the kurdish language because we have "no standard". well we do have standard kurmanci and standard sorani, it is MUCH MUCH easier to make everybody learn the 2nd dialect beside his own dialect then to make people speak and use a non existing new standard kurdish.

[King Diyako]

Totally irrelevant!! mixing dialect bring new, is sound like we don’t have language, what kind mentality is this, everywhere in world every state have multi dialect.

in Kurdish no dialect should ever mix with one another, it will bring destruction. Everything should be well protect even a village with 100 peoples which have their own dialect, The beauty of Kurdistan is relay on rich dialects.

However it can be adjustment where some word missing in either dialect which using turkish or Arabic or Irani, instead they should replace with word from a dialect which still have that word. So for that reason Kurdish language can be easily clean up from Arab Turkish and Irani dirt.

[dyaoko]

Hevalno, LANGUAGE is not something that we can create, we cant "create" a news kurdish language, a standart language or whatever. language is something that arises by itself, it arises by ppl speaking the language. you cant create something and ask / force ppl to use it, how is that going to work?

as kak dyaoko said, we must learn both dialects. variety in culture and language is not a bad thing.

I agree language is not something which we can create, but we can help the Nation to go in a path which in the futuer will lead to a language goal.

for example a good thing which KurdSat TV does is in the News Section,they read half of the news in Sorani and the other in Baidini (close to kirmanci)
I always learn some things from the news, so by time I have learn to undrestand the both dailect .

but about chanign a dialect, I think we just should use ALL the words we have , which are diffrent with other langauges . (persian -arab-...) .

[daristani]

Here's a proposal for a standardized Kurdish that combines Kurmanji and Sorani on a roughly equal basis:

http://www.geocities.com/mehname2006/74/diyari3.html

[Johny Bravo]

Here's a proposal for a standardized Kurdish that combines Kurmanji and Sorani on a roughly equal basis:

http://www.geocities.com/mehname2006/74/diyari3.html

Thank you, this document is very interesting and rally great, here stands:

4. CÎNAW

Le ZHK tena yek corey cînawan heye.

| Kurmancî | Soranî | ZHK |
| ez / min | min / -im | min |
| tu / te | to / -it | tu |
| ew / wî, wê | ew / -î | ew|
|em / me | ême / -man| me|
|hûn / we | êwe / -tan | we|
|ew / wan | ewan / -yan | ewan |

Nimûne

|Kurmancî | Soranî | ZHK|
|Ez dikim / Min kir | Min dekem / Kirdim | Min dekim / Min kirim |
| tu dixwînî / te xwend | To dexwênî / Xwêndit | Tu dexwînî / tu xwendî |

Le ZHK pêwîstî be cînaw her niye: (min) dekem, (min) kirim, (tu) dekî, (tu) kirî.
Le ZHK cînaw ne wek subje (kirde), ne wek obje (bireser) u ne şî le gel prepozîsyon yan postpozîsyon nagorrin:
- Min ew nasîm.
- Ew min nasî.
- Min le gel ew hatim.

5. Naw (Noun, substantive)

5.1. Zayend


Nêrî u mêyî le ZHK niye. Nimûne:

| Kurmancî | Soranî | ZHK |
| keça min | keçim / keçî min | keçî min |
| kurrê min | kurrim / kurrî min | kurrî min |
| jina wî | jinî / jinî ew | jinî ew |
| mêrê wê | mêrdî / mêrdî ew | mêrî ew |

5.2. Yekjimarî û komî

Le ZHK nîşanî nediyarbûn bo nawanî yekjimarî "-ek" yan "-yek" e:
- malek (yek mal)
- rojnameyek (yek rojname)

Eger naw diyar be, pêwîstî be hîç nîşan niye:
- mal (ne wek soranî "malleke")
- rojname (ne wek soranî "rojnameyeke")

Eger le paş nawî yekjimarî diyarkerek hebe, naw herfî "-î" yan "-y" werdegire:
- malî min, Jiyanî ciwan


- rojnamey kurdî, mamostay me

Nawî komî (plural, cemi') eger diyar yan nediyar be, nîşanî "-an" yan "-yan" heye:
- malan: Min malan debînim.
- rojnameyan: Tu çend rojnameyan dexwînî?

Eger le paş nawî komî diyarkerek hebe, naw herfî "-î" le "-an" yan "-yan" zêde debe:
- malanî tarî
- rojnameyanî kurdî

Eger jimare le pêş nawî komî hebe, "-an" ne pêwîst e:
- Min du sêw(an) xwarime.
- Ewan pênc kurr(an)î mezin hene.

5.3. Naw wek subje u obje

Nawî yekjimar wek subje (kirde) yan obje (bireser) hîç nagorre:
- Jiyan kitêb dexwîne. (Ne wek kurmancî: Fatma kitêbê dixwîne.)
- Jiyan kitêb xwendiye. (Ne wek kurmancî: Jiyanê kitêb xwendiye.)

Naw le gel prepozîsyon şî her wek xo demîne:
- be pênûs (ne wek kurmancî: bi pênûsê / pênûsî)
- le mal (ne: le malê)
- Ew ji Kurdistan hat. (ne: ji Kurdistanê hat.)
Eger naw komî be, "-an" be tena lê zêde debe:
- Azad kitêban dexwîne.
- Azad kitêban xwendiye. (ne: "Azadî kitêb xwendine." / "Azêd kitêb xwendine.")
- le rojnameyan nûsiye.

6. PREPOZÎSYON

Le ZHK tena 4 prepozîsyonî bingeyî (esasî) hen: be, bo, le û ji.

| Kurmancî | Soranî | ZHK | Nimûne |
|bi | be | be | Ew be çi hat? |
| (ji) bo | bo | bo | Ew bo çi ye? |
| ji ... re | bo | bo | Min name bo to nûsiye. |
| ji | le ... ewe | ji | Ji Kurdistan hatim Ewropa. |
| li | le | le | Le Ewropa dejîm |
| di ... de, di ... ve | le ... da | le le zimanî kurdî; le xanû |

Prepozîyonanî dî le eman durist debin, wek:
- le ser
- bo pêş
- ji jêr

7. WERB

7.1. Dem
Le ZHK werban du dem (kat) hen:

| Dem | Nimûne (belênî) | Nimûne (neyînî) |
1) | demî berdest: | (Min) deçim / dekim | (Min) naçim / nakim. |
2) | demî raborî, ke debe |
a) demî raborîy sade: | (Min) çûm / kirim. | (Min) neçûm / nekirim. |
b) | demî raborîy berdewam: | (Min) deçûm / dekirim. | (Min) nedeçûm / nedekirim. |
c) | demî raborî nîzîk: | (Min) çûme / kirime | (Min) neçûme / nekirime |
d) | demî raborîy dûr: | (Min) çûbûm / kiribûm. | (Min) neçûbûm / nekiribûm. |

Bekarînanî demî berdest
- bo karek ke car-car yan berdewam deke: Ew kitêban dexwîne. / We naçin der.
- bo karek ke niha (êsta) deke: Tu çî denûsî? Ewan bo çi nabêjin?
- bo karek ke le mirov ayinde bike: Min sibê ew debînim. Tu paşî naçî?

7.2. Pêşgiran u paşgiranî werban

| Demî berdest | Nimûne (belênî) | Nimûne (neyînî) |
| Min ...im / de...m: | (Min) deçim / dekim | (Min) naçim
| Tu ...î / de...y | (Tu) deçî / dekî | (Tu) naçî
| Ew ...e / de... | (Ew) deçe / deke | (Ew) naçe
| Me ...in / de...n | (Me) deçin / dekin | (Me) naçin
| We ...in / de...n | (We) deçin / dekin | (We) naçin
|Ewan ...in / de...n | (Ewan) deçin / dekin | (Ewan) naçin

| Demî raborîy sade | Nimûne (belênî) | Nimûne (neyînî) |
| Min ...im / ...m: | (Min) çûm / kirim | (Min) neçûm / nekirim |
| Tu ...î / ...y | (Tu) çûy / kirî | (Tu) neçûy / nekirî |
| Ew ...e / ... | (Ew) çû / kir | (Ew) neçû / nekir |
| Me ...in / ...n | (Me) çûn / kirin | (Me) neçûn / nekirin |
|We ...in / ...n | (We) çûn / kirin | (We) neçûn / nekirin |
| Ewan ...in / ...n | (Ewan) çûn / kirin | (Ewan) neçûn / nekirin |

| Demî raborîy berdewam | Nimûne (belênî) | Nimûne (neyînî) |
| Min de...im / de...m: | (Min) deçûm / dekirim| (Min) nedeçûm / nedekirim |
| Tu de...î / de...y | (Tu) deçûy / dekirî | (Tu) nedeçûy / nedekirî |
| Ew de...e / de... | (Ew) deçû / dekir | (Ew) nedeçû / nedekir |
| Me de...in / de...n | (Me) deçûn / dekirin | (Me) nedeçûn / nedekirin |
| We de...in / de...n | (We) deçûn / dekirin | (We) nedeçûn / nedekirin |
| Ewan de...in / de...n | (Ewan) deçûn / dekirin | (Ewan) nedeçûn / nedekirin |

| Demî raborîy nîzîk | Nimûne (belênî) | Nimûne (neyînî) |
| Min ...ime / ...me: | (Min) çûme / kirime | (Min) neçûme / nekirime |
| Tu ...iye / ...ye | (Tu) çûye / kiriye| (Tu) neçûye / nekiriye |
| Ew ...e / ...we | (Ew) çûwe / kire | (Ew) neçûwe / nekire |
| Me ...ine / ...ne | (Me) çûne / kirine | (Me) neçûn / nekirine |
| We ...ine / ...ne | (We) çûne / kirine | (We) neçûn / nekirine |
| Ewan ...ine / ...ne | (Ewan) çûne / kirine | (Ewan) neçûn / nekirine |

| Demî raborîy dûr | Nimûne (belênî) | Nimûne (neyînî) |
| Min ...ibûm / ...bûm | (Min) çûbûm / kiribûm | (Min) neçûbûm / nekiribûm |
| Tu ...ibûy / ...bûy | (Tu) çûbûy / kiribûy| (Tu) neçûbûy / nekiribûy |
| Ew ...ibû / ...bû | (Ew) çûbû / kiribû| (Ew) neçûbû / nekiribû |
| Me ...ibûn / ...bûn | (Me) çûbûn / kiribûn | (Me) neçûbûn / nekiribûn |
|We ...ibûn / ...bûn | (We) çûbûn / kiribûn | (We) neçûbûn / nekiribûn |
| Ewan ...ibûn / ...bûn | (Ewan) çûbûn / kiribûn | (Ewan) neçûbûn / nekiribûn |

8. JIMARE

| Kurmancî | Soranî | ZHK (sade) | ZHK (rêzî) |
|1 yek | yek | yek | yekem |
| 2 du | dû | du | duyem |
| 3 sê / sisê | sê | sê | sêyem |
| 4 çar | çiwar | çar | çarem |
| 5 pênc | pênc / penc | pênc | pêncem |
| 6 şeş | şeş | şeş | şeşem |
| 7 heft | hewt / heft | heft | heftem |
| 8 heşt, heyşt | heşt | heşt | heştem |
| 9 neh | no | no | nohem |
| 10 deh | de | de | dehem |
| 11 yazde(h) | yan(d)ze | yazde | yazdehem |
| 12 duwa(n)zde(h) | duwanze | duzde | dazdehem |
| 13 sêzde(h) | siyanze | sêzde | sêzdehem |
| 14 çarde(h) | çiwarde | çarde | çardehem |
| 15 pa(n)zde(h) | panze | pazde | pazdehem |
| 16 şazde(h) | şanze | şazde | çazdehem
| 17 hefde(h) hevde | hevde | hefde | hefdehem
| 18 hejde(h) hijde(h) | hejde | hejde | hejdehem |
| 19 nozde(h) | nozde | nozde | nozdehem |
| 20 bîst | bîst | bîst | bîstem |
| 30 sî, sih | sî | sî | sîhem |
| 40 çil, çel | çil | çil | çilem |
| 50 pêncî, pêncih | penca | pênca | pêncahem |
| 60 şêst | şest | şest | | şestem |
| 70 heftê | hefta | hefta | heftahem |
| 80 heştê | heşta | heşta |heştahem |
| 90 nod/not/newed | newed | nod | nodem |
| 100 sed | sed | sed | sedem |
| 1 000 hezar, hizar | hezar | hezar | hezarem |
| 1 000 000 | milyon | milyonem |
| 1 000 000 000 | milyar | milyarem |

9.1. Çend pêşgir û paşgiranî mişe:

Eger cudayî le kurmancî u soranî hebe, tercîh wa ye:

| Kurmancî | Soranî | ZHK ZHK Nimûne (K: kurmancî; S: soranî) |
| artin | ardin | arîn | bijêrîn, narîn (K: bijartin, hinartin; S: bijardin, nardin) |
| di- | de-, e- | de - | deçim, nedehat (K: diçim, nedihat) |
| hil | hell | hel | heldan, helgirtin |
| i | e | e | be, le (K: bi, li)
| în | an | an | gerran, çeman (K: gerrîn, çemîn = tewîn) |
| în | ên | în | dexwîne, bigerrîne (S: dexwêne, bigerrêne) |
| r | rd | r | birin, kirin, sar, zer (S: birdin, kirdin, sard, zerd) |
ve- | -ewe | we- | wekirin, wexwarin (K: vekirin, vexwarin; S: kiranewe, xwardinewe) |
| xwe | xo | xo | xo, xoş, xolî, xozî (K: xwe, xweş, xwelî, xwezî) |

9.2. Cudayiyanî giştî

1. Eger le şêwey zarawayek herfî "h" hebe u le yî zaraway dî nebe, yî bê "h" bibijêre:
- asan (ne: hêsan)
- erzan (ne: herzan)
- esp (ne: hesp)
- ewr (ne: hewr)

2. Eger pîtî "e" le gel "a, i, î, o, u, û" alternatîf be, "e" helbibijêre:
- behar (ne: bahar, bihar, buhar)
- kurre! (bangkirin le "kurr"; ne "kurro")
- keç (ne kiç)

3. Eger pîtî "a" le gel "i, î, o, u, û" alternatîf be, "a" helbibijêre.

4. Eger pîtî "ê" u "î" alternatîf bin, "î" helbijêre (bo nûsînî be alfabey kurdî-erebî asantir e).

5. Ji pîtî "o" u "u", tîpî "u" helbijêre (bo nûsînî be alfabey kurdî-erebî asantir e).

6. Le "î" u "î", tîpî "i" helbijêre çunke peyw kurttir debe:
- giring (ne: girîng)
- Xalid (ne: Xalîd)
- Iraq (ne: Îraq)

7. Eger "h" u "w" hebin, "w" bibêjere:
- wirç (ne: hirç)
- wur (ji S "wurd", ne: "hûr")

8. Ta gengaz be, peyw u şêweyanî hewbeş î kurmancîy standard (K) u soranîy standard (S) be kar bîne.

9. Eger le peyw u şêwey hewbeş peyda nebe, peyw yan şêwey kurttir be kar bîne.

[Sirwan]

Hi all! nice topic!
First of all it's not something bad if we have various dialects in Kurdistan. But regarding '''''creation'''' of a so-called Sormanji I tend to disagree with such a artificial mixing of Kurmanji and Soranias metioned above. (even its name is artificial!).

Please note that Sorani is a linguistic treasure for Kurds: It's a mix of Kurmanji and Hewrami, which today dominates much if not whole of southern and eastern Kurdistan or more precisely the region historically was known as lower Kurdistan. This important Kurmanji-Hewrami mixed dialect (i.e sorani) is something that unfortunately Kurmanji and Zazaki speakers have been so far unable to achieve. but we already know that Zazaki is very similar to Hewrami and therefore one can conclude that Sorani is even an indirect mixing of Kurmanji and Zazaki too.
Furthermore please do not forget that although Kurmanji is considered to have preserved many archaic features of an elder Kurdish, not necessarily it has preserved all aspects of Kurdish grammar. It has lost some garammatica features already preserved in Sorani. A mixing of Kurmanji and Sorani should somehow try to REcreate an older form of Kurdish.
One should not forget that while in medieval ages Kurmanji was a litarary language of many Kurds, since ninetheanth century it has been Sorani which had a better oppurtunity to evolve as a modern language. It is enough to mention that around 80% of Kurdish literature in twentieth centuryhas been writen in Sorani.
Thus the growing Sorani which already gramatically and even lexically is very rich, should only regain those unique features which Kurmanji could preserve but Sorani lost; and here we dont mean phonetical differences but mere grammatical ones; and these according to one my friends who spent many years researching this issue are as following:
A) Female Izafe in Kurmanji: Sorani can borrow this archaic feature; ex: gulA min, evinA min
B) RE-adding (not adding) of those pronounes which Sorani lost, namely ''ez, tu, hun (in some Sorani regions pronounced as engo), wî/wê .
Nothing gramatical more (or at least I dont remember since they were not important)
C) Some lexiac l borrowings. as lexical borrowing naturally and rapidly occur everytime and everywhere in the world this one is very very simple to obtain.

If A and B are done in Sorani soeaking media (TV, internet, radio, books, etc..) then C as well as the final goal which is emergence of a standard literary semi-official dialect for all Kurds is very very simple and automatically and naturally done during a few years.
And I like to remind you that this Kurmanjicized Sorani or better to say this ''''more archaic southern Kurmanji'''' is only for use in media and publications as a standard dialect but at the same time all other existing dialects and languages of Kurds should be respected, honored and taught in schools in the regions they are spoken.

[Diri]

Indeed, Sirwan, you are right about Soranî being an amalgam of Kurmancî and Hewramî/Goranî - which is also a theory and thesis supported by so to speak all scholar sources...

But we need to remember an important factor here: proportion.

More than half of all Kurds speak Kurmancî as their native dialect. All Bakûrî (more than 15 million) and Rojawayî (1.5 million) Kurds speak Kurmancî, while about 1.5 million Kurds in Başûr speak Kurmancî and about 2.5 million Kurds in Rojhelat speak Kurmancî as their native dialect.

In Başûr, closer to 4.5 million Kurds speak Soranî as their native dialect - whereas in Rojhelat about 5 million Kurds speak Soranî as their native dialect. The rest of the Bakûrî Kurds, about 3 million speak Zazakî, while the rest of Rojhelatî Kurds, about 3 million speak Goranî (including Hewramî and Lekî) as their native dialect.

Kurmancî speakers total: ca 21 million
Soranî speakers total: ca 9-10 million
Goranî speakers total: ca 3 million
Zazakî speakers total: ca 3 million

Total speakers of all Kurdish dialects/languages: ca 37 million Kurds

1/2 of all Kurds are native Kurmancî speakers. 1/4 of all Kurds are native Soranî speakers. While 1/8 of all Kurds are native Zazakî speakers and another 1/8 of all Kurds are native Goranî speakers.

These numbers are of course my own estimates - and based solely on personal research and reading from various sources, such as scholars and government institutions (KRG etc.)...

We must keep in mind that in addition to the 37 million Kurds who still speak their language (one dialect or more), there are also Kurds who have been assimilated and who've adopted either Turkish, Persian or Arabic as their first language. These are not included in my estimate - but would amount to around anywhere between 5 and 10 million additional Kurds... Of these 5-10 million Kurds, half do not identify as Kurds - while the other half (between 2.5 million and 5 million Kurds) still consider themselves Kurdish or of Kurdish origins.

It is vital for improving the Kurdish situation and position in real politiks that we KEEP all our dialects/languages alive and actively in use. Our position will be weakened the moment favouritism of one or the other happens.

For instance, there is a growing inclination to broadcast in Soranî and Kurmancî dialects while leaving Zazakî and Goranî to feel excluded and disowned. This in turn will lead to partition and dividing the Kurdish national movement into several smaller units - such as Zazakî who have started a movement for "Zazaistan" - and Hewramî/Feylî Kurds who have started a movement for "Sassanian Jaff region" - in e.g. Kurds are in effect segregating their own people and labeling them according to spoken dialect.

If you don't speak Soranî in Başûr Kurdistan, you are somehow not as Kurdish... Which is very tragic considering that nationality and patriotic feelings are found in the heart, not in the mouth... Some people SPEAK beautiful words - but their acts speak more than their words...

The KRG needs to establish and appoint an institution which should be given ONE simple role: translating/publishing everything into ALL four dialects/languages of Kurdish.

Official documents such as speeches, research, schematic planning and laws etc. should all be published in all 4 dialects/languages.

The KRG is a fantastic oppurtunity for Kurdistan to speak with ONE voice, if the National Assembly and cabinet of this Assembly only had the BRAIN to understand the duties and responsibilities which it carries in the larger scheme of the Kurdish national movement...