PKK & suicide attacks?

[Vladimir]

Recently this appeared in NY times...

"Even among Muslims, secular groups like the Kurdistan Workers' Party, the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine and the Al Aksa Martyrs Brigades account for more than a third of suicide attacks."

What's this bullshit? Bad informed or?? Give some more info.
I know the story about a Kurdish girl who blewn up some Turkish soldiers, but that was her own iniative..

Source: Blowing up an assumption

[kassem]

w

[dyaoko]

thank you vlad for this, vlad , can you please find out his e-mail or their -email? ...I know as you are a journalist it may be easier for you...

we must do something ....poor pkk do nothing...and blamed for everything...

I wish at least they had done what other acccuse them for it

[Piling]

well there had a few suicide bombing in 90s in Kurdistan of Turkey, but it was only against militarian targets, never against civilian ppl., and it was not frequent, not very efficient too. When the PKK did want to attack soldiers or govt employeers (as teachers) they rather shot.

"PKK suicides" is rather an immolation by fire, as a protest, and it harmed only their authors, but it was not an order from the hierarchy, more an individual decision, especially after Öcalan's arrest.

[Vladimir]

Damn..
It's also a reason because of AFP news..

"Two alleged Kurdish would-be suicide bombers and a Turkish soldier were killed Wednesday, in the latest episode of renewed tensions between Kurdish rebels and the Turkish authorities, officials and media reports said."

It would be really stupid if PKK is going to use suicide bombers now.. I can't imagine that.
Maybe I can find his e-mail if I have some time left between learning and writing articles for a new Kurdish website.

[kassem]

w

[Piling]

well if it is only against soldiers it is a act of guerilla, not terrorism. Terrorism is only against non-fighters population.

[kassem]

w

[Vladimir]

Well Kassem.. you are totally right.
When the arrested people PKK camps in the Netherlands all people were saying HOW COME THERE ARE TERRORISTS IN OUR COUNTRY.

Off course almost all people who got arrested were released.

[Diri]

Hey let's get a few facts straight!!


I am not PRO PKK and I am NOT PRO AMERICAN - In a sense I am - Because we may get somewhere with the help of one of them but not the other...

Okey - So what is the PKK???

The PKK is an organization/armed struggle against the state of TURKEY for victimizing, oppressing, raping, killing, kidnapping, torturing, denying and abusing the Kurdish people in Turkey basic humanrights and democratic freedom of speech and political organizing!

THIS IS ALL GOOD! SO FAR SO GOOD -

Okey - So what ideology does the PKK support???

1)The PKK is a MAOIST/MARXIST Organization/armed struggle against "democratic" and "turkish" Turkey. (AS SEEN FROM THE WEST)

2)The PKK is a MAOIST/MARXIST Organization/armed struggle for equal rights and democracy in the state called "Turkey". (AS SEEN BY THE PRO-PKK)

3)The PKK is a MOIST/MARXIST Organization/armed struggle for the independence of Kurdistan. (AS WAS THEIR CASE BEFORE THE CHANGES IN THE PARTY - going from PKK to KADEK and GONGRA GEL to PKK...)

4) The PKK is a MAIOST/MARXIST Organization/armed =(equals) TERRORIST ORGANIZATION. (AS SEEN BY THE TURKISH STATE)

Okey - lets just analyse some of what we have read so far=

1)The west obviously CARES weather or not the PKK is a communist party/org.

2) The people who are PRO PKK do NOT care what ideology the org. follows as they ONLY care about the aim and goal that it sets (e.g freeing Kurdistan/giving more rights to the people).

3) The PKK at first wanted an independent Kurdistan, but later "changed their minds" -since they thought it unrealistic to ever happen.

4) The Turkish state does have a point (in calling PKK TERRORISTS) in a few cases - There HAVE been times when the PKK has attacked the Kurdish population for not helping them and for not agreeing to fighting for them. (I'll come back to this in more detail)

So - Now there is a little sense of transparancy and somethings are a bit more logic!!!? Right? If not - tell me and I'll go in deeper details...



Now we have to catogorize (or however that word is spelled) the 4 point and put them in "POSITIVE" AND "NEGATIVE" BOXES -

It is also called the process of "PRO"(FOR) and "CONTRA"(AGAINST)

POSITIVE BOX= GOOD ABOUT THE PKK

1) The PKK has been one of many organizations who made the West familiar with the term "KURD" and "KURDISTAN.

2) The PKK has fought for Kurdish independence - (Positive only at the time it was advocating such claims - currently they don't).

3) The PKK has IN ONE WAY protected the Kurdishness of Kurdistan and made some people proud of being Kurds.

4) The PKK has fought for the democratization of the state called "Turkey".



NEGATIVE BOX= BAD ABOUT THE PKK

1) The PKK is NOT fighting for an INDEPENDENT KURDISTAN. It wants Northern Kurdistan to be a part of Turkey. The PKK have in this matter said things like "The Turks are our brothers" and "The Turkish flag is our flag too"... And whenever I switch to ROJ TV- I only see people shouting "Bijî Serok APO!" - Who is this "APO"??? Why do they shout his name instead of "KURDISTAN!"???

2) The PKK is a COMMUNIST PARTY/ORG. This in other words mean that no other than the Soviet UNION would support their fight (And we all know what happened to them???) The West supports Barzani and Talabani because they are PRO WEST - Not because they are democratic...

3) The PKK has a bad leader - when he was triald - he said "I want to apologize for all the pain I have caused Turkey"... This is what he SHOULD have said in ENGLISH: "I want a lawyer and someone to interpret for me" - Because he should not have accepted what was being done against him - He should have said - bring me a KURDISH TRANSLATOR- I don't understand Turkish - and then the WHOLE WORLD WOULD HAVE KNOWN THAT KURDS AND TURKS ARE NOT THE SAME!

4) The PKK HAS done terrorist acts: Such as molesting people, kidnapping people, killing people etc. (You who are PRO PKK would probably NOT believe such accusations- I understand this, but facts are facts and i have my own stories to go by- Once the PKK Guerilla came to my uncle's village. They didn't know eachother or anything - they just wanted him to join their armed struggle and to bring his two sons (aged 14 and 15) with him to fight against the Jandarma. But my uncle being a man with a family and 7 kids kindly told them not to ask this of him - they as he had to feed his family... and they told him he could go.. it was dark... and he wasn't gonna trust them... so when he had gone a few metres they started shooting at him - but luckely missed - He hid by the roadside till morning came and they had gone...) And I have heard HUNDREDS OF SUCH STORIES!


So apparantly the PKK is not the ideal party - it is less so than the PUK and the KDP - EVEN THOUGH WE ALL KNOW THAT ALSO THESE PARTIES HAVE A LONG WAY TO GO...
The PKK can't win the heart of Kurdistan as long as it is not asking for its hand in marriage... Kurdistan MUST BE FREE! Only then will there be no more problems in Turkey, Syria, Iraq and Iran... (Off course I am only talking about problems related to the Kurds...)

I love ALL of Kurdistan and I want ALL Kurds to feel like ONE - But something MUST be said for the sake of KURDISTAN, we cannot accept just anything for our only mother and provider... SET KURDISTAN FREE!!

I am myself not from South Kurdistan OR from the North - I am from the East and believe that I am less partial in my arguments.

FINALLY =

I hope people that see PKK as a terrorist organization will start seeing it as a libaration organization.
And I hope that people that are blinded by the propaganda from the PKK will open their eyes and be more open to what others may think of the PKK.

[kassem]

w

[Vladimir]

PKK/KDP/PUK have a lot of resemblances..

- They all have had support of the enemies of the Kurds.
PKK (Al-Assad/Saddam - Syria/Irak and maybe also Iran)
PUK (SADDAM/IRAN/) and nowadays TURKEY
KDP (SADDAM/ ?IRAN?) and nowadays also TURKEY

- They say they are for all Kurds, while they actually are more in favour of the Kurds in their "own " part.
- They are all talking about federation now and not independence.
- They are all saying Arab brothers or Turkish brothers.. . . ... I thought it were Kurdish parties, not "Turkey" party or "Iraqi" party.

- "Strong" leadership.. parties are very in favour of "One" leader. Doesn't matter what they do, the supporters will follow them.
.. Look to what ÖCalan said in his trial, Talabani said to Khatami.. etc..

- They all killed or supported struggle against eachother
PKK killed Kurds in Southern Kurdistan
KDP/PUK supported Turkish forces versus PKK
PUK or KDP betrayed KDP-I when Iran put pressure on them
--> Rest see enemies..

[kassem]

w

[Vladimir]

Ok, you are right. But still the "brother" thing. But I think it's normal with the Kurds to say "bra/brother" to a lot of people/

But having Turks could weaken your party, because they say it's a party from "Turkey".

[Piling]

pkk never was allied with saddam as far as I know?

It was. Just before the Gulf War of 91, they were allied with Saddam against Turks and US, but the war was very short and it had had no effects.

During the conflicts between PDK-UPK-PDK, Saddam as Iran suported alternatively each of them.

and concerning the murdering and the opression of Kurdish peasants by the PKK it is true, even in Europe they threaten Kurds, and now they even worked with the mafia...

I don't say that ALL the PKK, especially the former members were bad, some of them were fine fighters and idealists, as many communists in 30s or 40s, but totalitarism and fear within the party spoiled everything.

and concerning Öcalan's courage *cough cough* this man is afraid by his own shadow... but let's wait the second trial...